even when he was not president, you see what i'm -- israel, i used to go to his office when he used to come to turkey, he used to come to my office. so we know each other. but this time there of no such appointment, you see. >> if you met with president peres, what would you say to him? >> i'm telling that okay, approach realistically, and be realistic. of course, not the personal things. and think what happened and think the value of turkey. is it in your interests or not? >> to have a strong relationship? >> yes. >> but you would see him with no precondition? you don't -- you would be willing to meet president peres without an apology, just a conversation? >> no. i mean, what i see, they are defending their act, and criticizing us as if we did something wrong. with this understanding, how can i meet? i mean, the approach -- the feeling is important, first of all. how can i ignore my people who were killed? we are the -- we have the state tradition. we are, therefore, this 1,000-year tradition, state tradition we have, how can i forget all of these things? >> president gul, great plea